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Author Topic: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)  (Read 7824 times)

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Jenny89

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Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« on: January 26, 2010, 10:32:13 am »
Hey, I'm seriously considering to start transitioning as soon as possible. I'm almost 21 and have just scheduled a meeting with a therapist. I do have some questions though, and I hope this is the appropriate board to post it in :)

My first and most important question is: Am I able to pass (and hopefully even look good) when I start the transition as late as 21?

I have broad shoulders, is 6ft tall, have a big nose and a long face. I unfortunately consider my physical form rather masculine :(
I have light skin, blue eyes, blond hair, little body hair, no scars from acne, long legs, larger than normal ass and I have moisturized every day for over a year now, so I have pretty soft skin in my face.

My second question is: Am I able to conceal the fact that I'm on hormones to people? Are there dramatic changes when you start on hormones?

Money and pain is no problem for me :)

Thanks in advance! :)

Janet_Girl

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2010, 10:42:45 am »
Quote
My first and most important question is: Am I able to pass (and hopefully even look good) when I start the transition as late as 21?

Try it when you are 56.  Passing is a matter of attitude.  Start looking around and see that women come in all shapes and sizes.  Then quit worrying and just go for it.  Nothing ventured, nothing gained.


Quote
My second question is: Am I able to conceal the fact that I'm on hormones to people? Are there dramatic changes when you start on hormones?

When you start HRT, it will take time for anyone to realize that you are changing.  And this is a bonus, as they get use to seeing you differently.  So when RLE comes around, it is like "I thought you looked different".

Offline spacial

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2010, 11:22:29 am »
My time living as female was around the same as you.

I found foundation to be useful. The tone of your skin says most about you. It's the first thing we look at.

The principal differences between male and female, as far as I'm concerned is how they walk and stand.

Males tend to lean forward, especially when walking. They tend to keep their inner thighs apart, because of the luggage. Their elbows tend to point out and back. their hands tend to hang by their sides.

Females tend to be more upright and less confrontational. They tend to let their thighs touch. They tend to bend their elbows more, their hands over their body rather than at the side.

Males tend to look at you as if saying, what do you want?

Females tend to look at you as if saying, I'm here.

Hope this helps.

Offline barbie

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2010, 11:37:12 am »
Males tend to look at you as if saying, what do you want?

Females tend to look at you as if saying, I'm here.

Oh. I did not know that. Thanks for a nice tip.

I am here~~

Barbie~~
Just do it.

Chrissty

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #4 on: January 26, 2010, 12:20:13 pm »
Hi Jenny, :icon_wave:

Welcome to Susan's  :icon_flower:

Being tall does mean we need to be a little more cautious about our look...
...and what shoes heels we wear if we don't want to attract too much atention..
..but there are a lot of taller girls around these days to "blend" with.  ;)

 :icon_hug:

Chrissty

Offline Pippa

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #5 on: January 26, 2010, 03:45:46 pm »
A lot of GG's tower over me and I am not particularly short at 5'9".   Many GG's are also much broader than me. 

Passing is about attitude more than physique.  It also helps to think carefully about dressing and make up.  I have UK size 8 feet and if I were flats, I still feel like a golf club.  I therefore try to always pick shoes with a heel as this shortens the foot.   I try to avoid tops and dresses with shoulder pads as this emphasises the broadness of my shoulders.

 The net has plenty of self help guides to dressing and make up. As does Susan's.

We all worry about passing, even girls well along with transition.   My greatest fear at the moment is when I open my mouth.   It is a dead giveaway.  I am working on it but until then, I will get along as well as I can.   An 'I don't give a F**** what you think attitude' also helps.

If someone objects to you, what are they going to do about it.   I bet they will be more afraid of your reaction to them than their reaction to you.

Jenny89

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #6 on: January 26, 2010, 08:08:13 pm »
Thanks a lot for all answers so far, it's been helpful :)
But ugh :( I discovered that because I live in Norway (where it is very strict with medications and drugs), I need to have 1 year with a specialist to confirm that I have a Sexual Identity Disorder (that's what they call it) before I can start hormones :(

This really sucks :(. Is there any way to stop producing testosterone in my body without using hormones? Or is there a way to aquire anti-androgens without a prescription in Europe?

It's OP here btw, and thanks in advance for any answers :)


Offline spacial

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #7 on: January 26, 2010, 08:40:39 pm »


This really sucks :(. Is there any way to stop producing testosterone in my body without using hormones? Or is there a way to aquire anti-androgens without a prescription in Europe?

It's OP here btw, and thanks in advance for any answers :)

No, there is no safe way.

Please, please, do not try to buy drugs of any kind illegaly. You have no way of knowing what you are getting. Even if they properly labeled, you have no way of knowing if they have been stored correctly, manufactured correctly or even if they are out of date or not.

I'm really sorry about your enforced delay. But short cuts will almost certainly be a short cut to the mortuary.


Offline K8

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2010, 09:26:11 pm »
Welcome to Susan’s, Jenny.  :icon_flower:

There’s a lot of good information and good people here.  Each of our stories is unique but we have a lot in common.  Settle in, pull up a keyboard, and explore.

Be sure to look under the Announcements heading.  There you will find the rules we live by in this little world of ours: “Site Terms of Service and Rules to Live By”, “Standard Terms and Definitions”, and “Post Ranks”.  Look through the other stuff there, too, like “Age and the Forums”.

Don’t worry about your age.  I started transition at 65.  And don’t worry about your height, especially in Norway.

The others are right – it is about attitude and presentation.  Since you are delayed in starting hormones, you will have time to observe natural women. 

I found as a man I walked straight with little body movement and my arms swinging at my sides.  As a woman I tend to walk with sort of a small swivel in the middle of my back, my pelvis thrust slightly forward, and my elbows tucked but my forearms out.  As a man, the backs of my hands would face forward; as a woman they face out.

Animation is different, too.  As a man I would show little facial movement or hand movement; as a woman I am much more lively.  But look around.  Some of this depends on where you live.

And as Spacial said, there is no safe way to get hormones without a prescription.

And one more piece of advice, if you don’t mind: Your therapist is not there to block you.  Your therapist is there to help you discover how to become whole.  If your therapist is not there for that, you need to find another.

Good luck, Jenny.  And look around Susan’s.  There’s lots of information here.

Happy exploring. :icon_wave:

- Kate
Life is a pilgrimage.

Chrissty

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #9 on: January 27, 2010, 04:45:56 am »
Thanks a lot for all answers so far, it's been helpful :)
But ugh :( I discovered that because I live in Norway (where it is very strict with medications and drugs), I need to have 1 year with a specialist to confirm that I have a Sexual Identity Disorder (that's what they call it) before I can start hormones :(

This really sucks :(. Is there any way to stop producing testosterone in my body without using hormones? Or is there a way to aquire anti-androgens without a prescription in Europe?

It's OP here btw, and thanks in advance for any answers :)

If it's any consolation, the delay is about the same here in the UK for our health service.. but that's more down to disorganisation an bureaucracy. :-\

Yes it's relatively easy to obtain meds in Europe via the internet (well you would have found out sooner or later), but like K8 says, we don't recommend them. It's often not possible to ensure the source of the drugs, and you can cause yourself serious harm with the wrong dose, or if you have an underlying medical condition. ;)

I think you just have to make your case as best you can at your appointment, and see if there is any chance on a minimal dose of the AA's, as at 21 you may still get some limited skeletal effects...sounds like the E will have to wait though. :-\

Good Luck :icon_flower:

Chrissty

lilacwoman

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2010, 05:14:11 am »
No, there is no safe way.
 But short cuts will almost certainly be a short cut to the mortuary.

It would be interesting to actually find an autopsy report on someone who has died as a result of self medicating... I think that is a scare story put about by the control freak shrinks of the gender clinics.
If Norway was in the EU you have a Human Right to transition as soon as you feel like it and the HBSoC says you have to be stated on hormones pretty quick.

I

Hannah

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #11 on: January 27, 2010, 06:24:53 am »
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It would be interesting to actually find an autopsy report on someone who has died as a result of self medicating...

This made me smile. I have only read one self-medding damage case where I didn't think the person was a candidate for a Darwin award, and that involved someone stopping their aids drugs and not adjusting their estradiol dose. Most of the horror stories I've read about injury from self medding are from a mix of premarin and stupidity. I know how it sounds but if you need it bad enough you'll find a way, and if that way kills you then something else prolly would have gotten you sooner rather than later anyway.

Anyway if you go that route, be extra vigilant with blood work.

Offline Asfsd4214

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #12 on: January 27, 2010, 07:54:12 am »
It would be interesting to actually find an autopsy report on someone who has died as a result of self medicating... I think that is a scare story put about by the control freak shrinks of the gender clinics.

More than just the control freak shrinks... *looks around*.

It reminds me a bit of the thing I heard frequently from doctors in the beginning to excuse stalling despite my obvious commitment was about how "We have to protect against those young fellows who suddenly decide it would be neat to change their sex, so we need a bit of a cooling off period".

Come on, do they really exist? I doubt many if any people decide to transition literally on a whim.  ::)

Offline Renate

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2010, 08:09:35 am »
It would be interesting to actually find an autopsy report on someone who has died as a result of self medicating.

Autopsy? No, but I do know of someone whose kidneys got in trouble from Spironolactone. I do know of someone whose liver got in trouble from cyproterone acetate. I do know of someone who had a stroke from estrogen.

As much as this is not all a "whim", it is easy to find people who have started in on hormones only to decide that it was not the right thing for them.

I'm sorry to say that the TG cohort has more than its share of people with other mental or social problems. Whether this is cause or effect, I do not know.

Yes, there is also a large body of people also who are relatively sane and stable, who say, "This is me, this is want I want, where do I sign?" and moreover proceed in a straight line.

Offline Asfsd4214

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2010, 08:15:32 am »
Autopsy? No, but I do know of someone whose kidneys got in trouble from Spironolactone. I do know of someone whose liver got in trouble from cyproterone acetate. I do know of someone who had a stroke from estrogen.

As much as this is not all a "whim", it is easy to find people who have started in on hormones only to decide that it was not the right thing for them.

I'm sorry to say that the TG cohort has more than its share of people with other mental or social problems. Whether this is cause or effect, I do not know.

Yes, there is also a large body of people also who are relatively sane and stable, who say, "This is me, this is want I want, where do I sign?" and moreover proceed in a straight line.

May I ask how old the kidney trouble victim was?
How about the age of the stroke victim, was it ethylestradiol? Were they doing above a typical dose? How do you know it was a stroke "from estrogen", and that they wouldn't have had it anyway?

I'm not saying things can't happen unpredictably and without doing anything wrong. But more often than not there turns out to be extenuating circumstances.

Offline K8

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2010, 08:20:49 am »
OK.  Against my better judgment I will jump in here.

I am old and spent a career in the military, so perhaps my views are colored by those things.

Transition, including hormones and surgery, will drastically alter your life.  It is not like popping some pills to stay awake to study or to get high.  It is not even like getting a tattoo or piercing.  It will change your life forever.

If you could do it completely on your own, there would be no controls.  But since you need help – medicine and surgery – those providing that help want to assure themselves they are doing the right thing.  Their insurance companies want to be assured, too.

To me, it is entirely reasonable that there be a waiting period with proper counseling before acting on any drastic life-altering decision – decisions to transition, to alter one’s body significantly, to get married, to have children. 

The problem that I see is that sometimes those who are tasked with helping us get on some kind of power trip, but that’s another issue.

And, as I said, I am old and spent more than 20 years taking and giving orders.

:icon_anger: *end of rant* :icon_redface:

- Kate
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Offline Asfsd4214

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2010, 08:39:11 am »
OK.  Against my better judgment I will jump in here.

I am old and spent a career in the military, so perhaps my views are colored by those things.

Transition, including hormones and surgery, will drastically alter your life.  It is not like popping some pills to stay awake to study or to get high.  It is not even like getting a tattoo or piercing.  It will change your life forever.

If you could do it completely on your own, there would be no controls.  But since you need help – medicine and surgery – those providing that help want to assure themselves they are doing the right thing.  Their insurance companies want to be assured, too.

To me, it is entirely reasonable that there be a waiting period with proper counseling before acting on any drastic life-altering decision – decisions to transition, to alter one’s body significantly, to get married, to have children. 

The problem that I see is that sometimes those who are tasked with helping us get on some kind of power trip, but that’s another issue.

And, as I said, I am old and spent more than 20 years taking and giving orders.

:icon_anger: *end of rant* :icon_redface:

- Kate

Arbitrary waiting periods are just that, arbitrary. A once size fits all approach is a recipe for problems. And there's a difference between reasonable hesitation, and unreasonable. 1 year is utterly unreasonable.

Offline spacial

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2010, 09:19:38 am »
It would be interesting to actually find an autopsy report on someone who has died as a result of self medicating... I think that is a scare story put about by the control freak shrinks of the gender clinics.
If Norway was in the EU you have a Human Right to transition as soon as you feel like it and the HBSoC says you have to be stated on hormones pretty quick.

I

Setting aside the possible side effects of many of these drugs, which some taking them have complained about on this forum.

Buying drugs from an unverified supplier is about as stupid as crossing the road without looking.

I made the point. If someone wants to ignore it, that is their choice.

There are many people who say that the restrictions on the sale of drugs is pointless. Not because of the potential harm they do, but becuase these restrictions tend to save the lives of the terminally stupid, when nature has decreed that these people should die off in Darwinian fashion.

I'm not one of those, but I can see the point.

Janet_Girl

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2010, 10:49:30 am »
When I began, it was by self-medication.  My doctor was not a happy camper when I told him.  He told me that seeing I was already medicating, the least he could do is make sure I was safe.

Many people self-medicate will all kinds of things.  Alcohol, OTC sleeping pills, herbal remedies, etc.  And it can and does lead to heath problems.  A doctor is there to catch any potential health problems.

If you self-medicate, please have your blood check regular.  And get your doctor on board so that you don't kill yourself in the process.

Kay Henderson

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Re: Starting MTF transition, some questions :)
« Reply #19 on: January 27, 2010, 11:05:50 am »
As a person who is blessed with good health, I thought long and hard before self-medicating.

It's not the ideal, of course...and I would never go so far as to recommend it to anyone because of the many possible medical complications that could ensue.

I've satisfied myself that I'm taking all the right precautions, and I hold no one else responsible for my choice.  The only factor beyond my control is the quality of the medication, but in my case the results have spoken for themselves.  I've bought from the same supplier for quite some time and have never had a problem.

In addition to scrupulous blood level monitoring, my VA nurse practitioner and I always check other test results that might indicate a propensity for heart attack or stroke (I have none) or prostate problems (again, none).  Because of my age and to err on the side of caution, I've used only transdermal and sub-lingual delivery of estrogen to avoid putting unnecessary strain on my liver.

I've recently learned that my local VA Medical Center may be one that allows transgendered patients to be treated in the Women's Clinic as long as they present themselves as female (to avoid discomfort on the part of the genetic women).  So I'll investigate that possibility and could be able to obtain my medication that way in the future.

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